[hilbertsawhat]

This thread is missing discussion of blondes. That would be considered a perk of a job in Sweden I think. Or is that a myth?

We have blondes but to me it feels like people overestimate the number of blonds we have. You also have to count the different shades! I for example love slutty light/bright blond hair and feel nothing at all for dark blonde, I don't even count them. If I'd have to guess I'd say around 30% bright blond in Stockholm and where I live id prolly say 10%. I'm only counting people in the ages 18-40, kids/teenagers girls tend to have a higher percentage of blondes.

EDIT: http://www.nattstad.se/vimmel
You can now judge for yourself Bigger pictures are galleries. I think that the percentage will be higher in those picture than that of the general population. It does how ever give you a pretty decent idea of how it will look at the club in Stockholm.

EDIT2: ****ed up with the URL.

[Nasir]

derrrrrrrrrp never mind. going somewhere else. moar info soon. basically i can't cope with my excitement right now ;\ ...**** topics.

----

Hilbert - I edited my original reply out because I just realized who you are. A few other things just became massively clear too. Frankly, I'm surprised at your lack of understanding on how these things work. Or, perhaps, you're right and I'm simply entirely wrong about software engineers in Sweden. You would, obviously, know pretty well. I hope, for your sake, I'm just massively wrong.

However, if you're really getting paid what you said, I'd consider looking around. Although, you're obviously not doing .NET now based on some of the posts you've made so I have no idea what you should be expecting. You're clearly out of touch with how things work in the .net world now.

[hilbertsawhat]

Hilbert - I edited my original reply out because I just realized who you are. A few other things just became massively clear too. Frankly, I'm surprised at your lack of understanding on how these things work. Or, perhaps, you're right and I'm simply entirely wrong about software engineers in Sweden. You would, obviously, know pretty well. I hope, for your sake, I'm just massively wrong.

However, if you're really getting paid what you said, I'd consider looking around. Although, you're obviously not doing .NET now based on some of the posts you've made so I have no idea what you should be expecting. You're clearly out of touch with how things work in the .net world now.

I don't entirely understand why knowing who I am would prevent you from discussing with me, assuming that I don't live next door. So in other words; no you don't know me. I have however seen you post multiple times, I to some extend know you.

You are still trying to tell me how the job situation is in my country, even after I've linked to multiple sources so that you could get a lay of the land. I obviously know other programmers, and since some of them are what I call "friends" (~10 .net, ~6 JavaEE, ~2 other), I actually know how much money they make and it supports my view of things. You don't have to hope anything for me, if I don't like my situation I'll do like you are planing to and move.

You are surprised at my lack of understanding of how these things work, but I'm quite sure that I've lived in more countries than you, worked in more countries than you and I've belonged to more "classes" than you. These statements are assumptions but I'm pretty sure they are correct. Still, I'm the one that doesn't understand.

You're attempt to give me advice regarding my profession in my country. This with no actually information about salary statistics, my work history, my knowledge, my age, my IQ, my creativity level and my social skills and you call me pretentious. I mean before I could understand that you were misinformed and I was kind of messing with you while still providing some information, but now...I really don't get it.

So I have to ask, are you clinically insane man? I mean really, there has to be something wrong with you. I'm decent at personality disorders but I don't know you well enough to help/call you out. If I had to guess (I don't, but I'm going to) I'd say histrionic, narcissistic or asperger? Feels like you are a bit too focused for ADHD. Yeah I know, they are far from each other but they have overlapping traits. I never really say narcissistic as most of us are [more or less] at a young age, but damn, your balls should have dropped by now and facts should be able to convince even you.

And once again you managed to make a ****ed up assumption. "You're obviously not doing .NET now based on some of the posts you've made", lol..? 70% of my work is with [multiple] .Net projects I manage/code, rest is JavaEE. I've linked to recent articles with actual .Net salaries and it supports what I'm saying but still... You have to be out of touch with reality or do you think that I'm nit picking the information I'm linking so I can fool you not to come to Sweden? I know for a fact that I make more than most of my peers and your telling me to switch jobs and that I'm out of touch with the .Net world? You are funnziz, much like Harry Dunne.

Kind of broke what I said in the previous post but you trigger my raging dickyness. It be funz, but...back to one liners. I think.

[Rob]

let's talk about chicks man.

[Nasir]

I don't entirely understand why knowing who I am would prevent you from discussing with me, assuming that I don't live next door. So in other words; no you don't know me. I have however seen you post multiple times, I to some extend know you.

You are still trying to tell me how the job situation is in my country, even after I've linked to multiple sources so that you could get a lay of the land. I obviously know other programmers, and since some of them are what I call "friends" (~10 .net, ~6 JavaEE, ~2 other), I actually know how much money they make and it supports my view of things. You don't have to hope anything for me, if I don't like my situation I'll do like you are planing to and move.

You are surprised at my lack of understanding of how these things work, but I'm quite sure that I've lived in more countries than you, worked in more countries than you and I've belonged to more "classes" than you. These statements are assumptions but I'm pretty sure they are correct. Still, I'm the one that doesn't understand.

You're attempt to give me advice regarding my profession in my country. This with no actually information about salary statistics, my work history, my knowledge, my age, my IQ, my creativity level and my social skills and you call me pretentious. I mean before I could understand that you were misinformed and I was kind of messing with you while still providing some information, but now...I really don't get it.

So I have to ask, are you clinically insane man? I mean really, there has to be something wrong with you. I'm decent at personality disorders but I don't know you well enough to help/call you out. If I had to guess (I don't, but I'm going to) I'd say histrionic, narcissistic or asperger? Feels like you are a bit too focused for ADHD. Yeah I know, they are far from each other but they have overlapping traits. I never really say narcissistic as most of us are [more or less] at a young age, but damn, your balls should have dropped by now and facts should be able to convince even you.

And once again you managed to make a ****ed up assumption. "You're obviously not doing .NET now based on some of the posts you've made", lol..? 70% of my work is with [multiple] .Net projects I manage/code, rest is JavaEE. I've linked to recent articles with actual .Net salaries and it supports what I'm saying but still... You have to be out of touch with reality or do you think that I'm nit picking the information I'm linking so I can fool you not to come to Sweden? I know for a fact that I make more than most of my peers and your telling me to switch jobs and that I'm out of touch with the .Net world? You are funnziz, much like Harry Dunne.

Kind of broke what I said in the previous post but you trigger my raging dickyness. It be funz, but...back to one liners. I think.

Really, it was simply that I've seen your code and know exactly what you can do. Also that it was rather pointless to keep arguing because I do have a good idea of what your jobs have been since around 2008. I've actually internet-stalked you a bit because I was curious. Granted, I was trying to be insulting, but I really do think you can make more if you're making 25k SEK or whatever (too lazy to look on other pages) when I clearly saw that a lot of direct-hire .NET web developer positions started at 30k SEK and I'm making roughly 50K SEK in the US. I'm serious in that, perhaps, you can be making a bit more, especially if you're still leading teams.

I mean I'm clearly looking at direct hire positions starting at 30k SEK and ranging to 45k SEK for mid to senior level positions. I'm not understanding how <= 25k SEK makes sense here at "top of your field." Go work on the WP7 Skype team... I know you qualify and it'll definitely pay more.

I really didn't ask for a lay of the land, info about the Swedish job market, or salary ranges. I'm perfectly capable of figuring that stuff out and choosing to apply for positions that meet my salary requirements and that's why I didn't ask about that sort of stuff. However, finding the "most common" job posting site is really more something that I have to ask someone who uses it frequently. That's like choosing between jobing.com or careerbuilder.com here. Frankly, I still don't know which one is more popular. (granted, i use neither of them.)

I honestly wasn't intenting to be a jerk, but you pretty much drowned in rage when I used the 5% number. I looked it up and the quote was actually "...a factor of a thousand compared to a factor of a million in the united states." Yes, the number I said was wrong. That's why I prefixed it with the word "like"... in English, that generally indicates I'm pulling a number largely out of my ass. So when you're going to flip your shit and call me an ignorant american retard for a statement that wasn't intended to be read so literally, you really struck a huge nerve with me. My only intent was to express that the wage conversion wasn't hugely different to what I'm making for the direct-hire jobs that I've seen and that the difference would most likely be compensated by the fact that the richest and poorest classes aren't as seprated as they are here, in the United States.

And yes, I do have information about your work history, how much you were making at (as of ~4 years ago), your age, your programming background, where you went to school, that I believe you went to germany for a bit for (an internship? was it Germany? I don't remember?), and I'm pretty sure I never commented on your social skills. You told me all of that shit yourself. Moreover, I actually refactored a shit ton of webforms crap under you until I stopped when I got a proper developer job here in the uS.

I also remember you telling me that I was making more than you when I first started my career, so I already knew salaries in Sweden were lower. /You/ actually told me that in 2008, I believe. ...however I'm also very aware of how life, in general, balances out just about no matter where you go. I never claimed I'd make exactly as much, but I do know my financial status would be comparatively the same. Or at least I feel I know that. Maybe I am entirely wrong.

And as far as your code not being in .NET, that was pretty much 100% an insult. Obviously it is.

[Eru]

[Nasir]

i only skimmed hilbersawhat's post ;\\\

also: there's really a pony gif for everything isn't there? :O

[Rob]

50k SEK? Not bad. How many Swedish fish can you buy with that?

[Nasir]

I actually have an unhealthy obsession with Swedish fish. Good lord ;\ ...i'll eat them until I'm sick.

[Rainbow Dash]

Well you can get 1KG Fiskar för about 60kr at an average store so thats alot of Fiskar.

[Lederoil]

The thing I was reading was where some guy looked swedish, had a swedish name, and could speak swedish, but was an immigrant and it took him 2 years to find a job.

I'm not sure if you're talking about one guy specificly or generally, but I call bullshit in either case. Obviously, the qualifications you need to get a job is not about to look swedish, having a swedish name and being born in sweden. There's tons of reason why such guy in your example wouldn't get the jobs he's looking for. E.G. lack of education, the education he has gotten abroud doesn't hold the swedish standards, lack of motivation, his swedish is not as good as necessarely (e.g. customer service-jobs), demanding/searching for jobs higher than his own standard, attitude problems etc. etc.

Let me make my point even clearer by making another example; The thing I was reading was some guy looked normal, he had an average swedish haircut, dressed in normal clothes, and had a hat on his head. It took him 2 years to find a job.

I understand you have read something like that though, because that's the swedish political correct agenda and that's the only thing they focus on when they try to find connections in things - "Oh! He doesn't get a job because he's immigrant!". A famous and former party leader of the next biggest party in sweden, Mona Sahlin who also got the second most votes in the election of prime minister, said "If two equally qualified people apply for the same job, the one named Mohammed shall have the job.". With that said, Sweden and most of its people are very pro-immigrants, too much if you ask me.

Nasir, if you find a decent job as a normal employee you can expect a salary from 20-26k SEK give and take. I think you have fairly good chances in finding a job since you have the opportunity to settle down/search for jobs anywhere in the country and aren't restricted to a certain area. Also, pretty much every swede knows english so the communication shouldn't be a problem.

EDIT;
Sweden is not significantly more expensive than the rest of Europe. A high living standard with a salary that matches the prices. The summers are awesome, with the days with nice weather making up for the, sadly somewhat many, rainy days. The winters can be very cold and might seem long and boring, but they can be really nice and beautiful if you simply find something to do and enjoy.

The people are generally very nice, outgoing and good at small talk, which is what's high valued in social situations. With this being a priority, swedes are somewhat shallow and hard to talk to about actually interesting things until you get to know them or get drunk with them. The social acceptance is a very important part in many swedes lives and that's why the political correctness is very strong in Sweden. An average swede's opinion is mainly molded from what is accepted by the majority of the people. Be careful to express the wrong opinion conserning sensitive subjects in the wrong environment or it might lead to serious consecvenses, even as far as losing your job.

[Eru]

lots of words