[imported_Jackal]

Well then if people arnt fighting or ganking right now its probally cause they chose not to and wont ever. You guys are saying you guys want ganks and pvp but all I see you guys doing is hanging out in pits. You guys barely use the duel stones these days even when pvpers are on you guys just want events, or log just log on to join a event hat is gonna happen. I think you guys need to look why there isnt any pvp or ganks going on its cause you guys arent trying hard enough. I see madman and gangbang and tech in the pits just chillin waiting for someone to run to occlo but noone really ever does, and if they do they recall real fast just to get shits and giggles i guess. You guys arent starting any action hardly yourself so what would it matter if we put a system thats say you have left the pits. Honestly as staff what can we do to improve PvP? I see nothing because people who want to PvP are gonan PVP and people who dont want to arent. Its very simple you guys have to start making action yourself if you want to have mroe fun and make more things go on. Like Hatei believe posted before since most of you are pretty wealthy run into occlo with some worthwhile gear, seriously who wants to kill someone just for some regs, a little scrolls some pots, crap armor and a crap wep. That doesnt draw any intrest to me when i could go and get that stuff in no time if i really wanted it. You have to look at it from all points of view. Anytime something is going on we usually broadcast it. So I feel we cant do much more other then that on are part. It is up to you guys to make things happen and from what ive seen you guys arent trying at all.

[imported_Gang-Bang]

Its up on players to make fun. And btw, I think u missed the point. The ones who like to PvP would go ocllo on their own, and yeah I'm not that rich to motivate ppl with xtreme armor or something like that everytime I want to gank, seriously to make 10mins of fun you suggest me hunt non-stop for several weeks and collect full set of good armor?
Yeah its up on us to make our own fun, and in same time its up on you to make server fun and make players join the server:/ When theres only 25 its really nothing to do. Take a look at it from our stand point, theres only 5-10ppl who ganking, do u expect everyone of em to gank non stop whenever they enter game and stop only when they log out? And seriously I don't see new PvPers joining the server, however theres alot who likes this PvP. Arguements are always same - "Almost noone ganking, no tours"

Edit: And btw, "a little scrolls and some pots" - I never have less than 60manas on me, and around 100fs scrolls (50nos 50xuo) rest scrolls 50 each. If its not enought to motivate ppl, well then, this server is dead... from pvp standpoint ofc.. nothing else to add...

[imported_Jackal]

Im not saying go out and wear extreme ar. The only ar i see anyone go into occlo with is ice or lower. Its not that hard to mine for a little bit to get maybe a set of fire or something that looks of intrest or draw people to. I do understand the point you guys are making but we as staff can only do so much if you guys as the players dont do anything to promote it as well. And yea there is alot of people that do like this pvp style but were are they at? All I see is you guys hanging around in pits waiting for a event, if we hosted events non stop dont you think in some way that might effect the economy? Giving out tickets left and right for events will only make the economy worse in my opinion.

[imported_Gang-Bang]

I already tried to stay at bridge in full blackdiamond and jumping in ocllo. Even if someone will follow me, its the ones of 5-10ppl that I mentioned. Noone else. And other people who loved this pvp already went to another servers, or just stopped. Cos they don't like that people is barely ganking. Its really funny how people who never ever gank trying to remove pits and saying that it will increase ganking. Anyways, this is just pointless discussion aint going bring us anywhere.
Btw lately I see alot of things being added. Craftables, etc, etc... And everytime I say that there is nothing to do im getting always same answer - "There is alot things to do, you just never leave pits"
But what if i joined this server only cos it was "PvP/RP" oriented.
And these new things that u keep adding won't bring a single PvPer on server, trust me.

[imported_Jackal]

Then my question to you is what can we do to make you guys happy? Without going out of limits and putting other players who dont want to be involved with any of this in jeporady of not even being able to even hunt knowing the risk that people know right where there at.

[imported_Shai]

Hey Shai, remind me to call your next suggestion pure ignorance when you think something will help out the shard.

Why don't you try giving some explanations on why you think something won't work instead of just dismissing it as pure ignorance when we are trying to find ways to help improve the shard? Or better yet why don't you give some suggestions to help make it into an idea that can be implemented. The kind of response you're giving really doesn't encourage people to bring their ideas to the shard to help make it better. All it does is further stagnate the shard from a lack of diversity, and that's what a shard needs to prosper.

This might be a pvp oriented suggestion, but that doesn't mean it deserves to be turned down before it's even given a chance. As you said, this is a RP/PVP shard so where's the harm in doing a little something for the pvpers now and then?

You say people need to be less dependent on events, and here's a suggestion to help make that happen yet you're so fast to shoot it down without any suggestions to try and help it out.

I'm not even a big PVPer yet I've given almost a dozen different ways this idea could be implemented so it doesn't make people paranoid about leaving town but can still make the game more fun for others.

Now if people are too stubborn to team up because there's a greater possibility they get ganked, let them be idiots and hurt themselves. If a by-product of this suggestion is more interaction between players, is that really such a bad thing? Will people really stop hunting completely? Pretty sad if that's all it takes to get people to stop.

And in case you've gotten lost or confused in this thread, the suggestion smoke gave was to have a single system message when someone left pits. That's it, that's all. I said it's a great idea provided it doesn't tell people where else you went. Where's the harm in seeing a message 'shai left pits'? It doesn't tell anybody where you went and that's a million times less specific then xyz co-ordinates on the status page.

Re-read the thread if you got confused before you call something pure ignorance because this is a worthwhile suggestion as far as a number of players are concerned. And in the end you won't see a system message saying 'shai recalled to the xtreme wyrm on level 3 of destard' so it doesn't affect hunting at all.

Your missing the point. The 'idea' isn't just to add "XXXXX departed from the pits". Please go back and read what people were really asking. That may have been where it started out, but quite frankly people want what region they are in now too. All I'm saying is that a majority of our players aren't really pvpers. Sure we have quite a few but in general we have a small player base. I honestly don't think this will help bring the player base "up", when new people join and they're location is spammed on the screen or is on the status page or wherever, for the pvp'ers to come and waste. And Technique, what makes you think that they wont recall when they're locations are on the status page? Sure, you will find them faster, but they will recall, or try anyways, regardless if the info is on the page or not.

Eighty, I didn't say your suggestion was pure ignorance, I said, thinking that new players or players in general that aren't pvp oriented will like this idea, shouting up and down that they are going to get ganked every 5 seconds because everyone knows where they are all the time, that's being ignorant.
I don't mean to shoot any ideas down, it not like the decision is based on what I think alone. I'm just trying to use good logic. As this could really screw some things up for people, or make them better.

There's no harm to try it I guess, that's the only real way we will know. But I don't think I agree with the exact region being displayed on the page, as this could result in more people sitting around in the pits, whichhhhhhh I believe is the issue we are trying to fix.

EDIT: And I am a rhyming mistress.

[imported_Jackal]

And these new things that u keep adding won't bring a single PvPer on server, trust me.

What would adding quests and new log types have to do with a player not wanting to join? Were not trying to get a specific person type of person to join we are trying to get new people to join period. Whether Im a PvPer or not if i see that a shard is putting quest or new craftables avaiable to me that shows they are improving there shard.

Your argument here makes no sense to me. Personally if I were you I would just want people to join period. Even if they dont PvP cause you never know they might find they like it in the future and start. Adding stuff to the shard that does not effect your guy's PvP spices up the shard. It makes its unique from other shards.

The way you say that your basically saying you just want PvPer's to join. Sorry to tell you were not just a PvP shard were a community that is there for whatever a person choses to do in there UO life. They said the PvP wouldnt be tweaked and it hasnt it has stayed the same. I dont know why you think that adding craftables and quests would even push a PvPer away or even discourage a PvPer from joining the shard.

[imported_Gang-Bang]

Did I say that it will push a PvPer away or discourage to join? I just said that it won't ENCOURAGE them to join. If server can't offer ganking/PvPing 24/7 , or even at least one hour a day and staff keep telling to PvPers "go entertain youselves" you think he will stay on this server and getting fun?
And sorry to tell you but its not PvP server at all, its just a server where PvPing is allowed and PvP events being held.
And what I can suggest to make it fun for PvPers? Events. Yes, PvP events. Until our playerbase will grow enought to make PvPers entertain themselves without help from the staff. 60++ Ppl would be enought, not less:/

[Eighty Swords]

I decided to come back to UO about 2 months ago because I thought I'd have a say on how things went but the staff seem so lopsided in favor of RP over PVP and they seem so scared to disrupt any RP feeling that it's hard to get anything me and other pvpers are interested in actually implemented.

How many suggestion hasn't been wasted because of all the PVPers who are soooo afraid of making the tiniest little changes in PVP? How hard hasn't it been to get things implenteded because of this? For example, my suggestion of different leather armor, when YOU told it would change the PVP so much and even Maka said he guaranteed it wouldn't???! Please Eighty, you've been the worst of them all, and you don't bearly know the PVP... Jesus Christ you're ****ed up! Open your god damn mind sometime... It's scary how you always see things from only one point of view...

The problem is Lederoil, that before the server was even open for a month people were asking to get things changed on the pvp without even giving it a chance! Of course you won't like something the first time you try it, just like beer. At first it tastes gross but then you start enjoying it after trying a few different ones and given time it doesn't even have a little bit of a bad taste. For the younger players here think vegetables... maybe you didn't like carrots the first time you had them cooked but then you had them raw and now you're orange because you like them so much.

I can't believe how incapable you are of moving on from a discussion! That suggestion was over 2 years ago and you suggested modding armors so they added to or removed from tactics based on the realism aspect to it where iron is heavier then cloth so you aren't as mobile, or something like that.

At the time I did say it would change pvp because you have to start thinking "the guy has a +20 bard, but his armor takes off 30, oh wait he's not wearing the full set, so it only takes off 23 tactics" so every duel you have to think of the bonuses and drawbacks to each opponents equipment and then it starts becoming like an aos shard, not old, simple, nice and easy sphere like we're all used to and came specifically to INX to play.

If we had implemented your suggestion or people didn't argue so heavily against it, the next thing you know someone is going to say "well this weapon should add fire damage and that means it should do extra damage against ice armor", etc. And congratulations you just made a AOS shard like every other one out there.

And like Taran said, in the merge it was agreed to keep the XUO pvp. Now maka did say this wouldn't really change pvp, so fine, maybe I was wrong saying it would change pvp, I admit it. Want a hero biscuit or something? Seems like that's what you're hoping for by bringing it up 2 years later.

It's funny how you always say I have this 1 sided point of view, when if you really read my posts you would see on every topic I have a different point of view. As I've mentioned a few times, I don't even PVP much but I argue for suggestions to help PVPers all the time. Other times I'm making all kinds of suggestions to help crafting. Yes I sure do have only 1 point of view or only my motives at heart to improve the PVP aspect of the shard when I don't even PVP much...

Btw Lederoil, I'd appreciate that when you quote me you take the whole sentence so you don't distort my opinion to suit your needs.

Maybe if you ex. XUOers would agree on some changes that's affecting your playstyle for once before you start bringing up bullshit suggestion like this.

Alright wise guy, explain why it's such a bullshit suggestion when it barely has an influence at all on how someone will go about playing INX. What kind of "I don't want to play this shard any more" repercussions are there from this idea?

I mean come on guys, me, madman, and smoke all agree on something. It has to be good!!!

This was the most ironic thing I've read in a while...

Well you have to admit that doesn't happen often! And now even gang bang wants to see it happen lol!

And now I'm done arguing with you because you are the epitome of a forum troll who sticks around without contributing and just to try and piss people off.

Your missing the point. The 'idea' isn't just to add "XXXXX departed from the pits". Please go back and read what people were really asking. That may have been where it started out, but quite frankly people want what region they are in now too.

Well if the only portion of the suggestion that people agree with is to just say when someone left pits, leave it at that. We all posted these extra suggestions to try and make it even better and how to make it fair for people who don't want to use it, and then ways to stop people from cheating the system. All these extra suggestions doesn't mean they have to also be added.

All I'm saying is that a majority of our players aren't really pvpers. Sure we have quite a few but in general we have a small player base. I honestly don't think this will help bring the player base "up", when new people join and they're location is spammed on the screen or is on the status page or wherever, for the pvp'ers to come and waste.

I don't think it will help bring the playerbase up either, but it if people think it will make the server more enjoyable for them without taking too much away from others, why not do it to satisfy your existing customers (aka players).

Eighty, I didn't say your suggestion was pure ignorance, I said, thinking that new players or players in general that aren't pvp oriented will like this idea, shouting up and down that they are going to get ganked every 5 seconds because everyone knows where they are all the time, that's being ignorant.
I don't mean to shoot any ideas down, it not like the decision is based on what I think alone. I'm just trying to use good logic. As this could really screw some things up for people, or make them better.

Well that's the thing, someone suggested we do a-b-c, and other people gave their suggestions to do a-b-c and d-e-f. Your post sounds as if you are saying no to a-b-c-d-e-f and not just the extra part of d-e-f, at least that's the way I read it.

And again, the MAIN part of the suggestion was to have a system message say when someone left pits, not every other area they entered. I then suggested it would make sense if the message says "Eighty Swords entered Minoc" or wherever the player went from pits instead of just "Eighty Swords left pits" since seeing "Eighty Swords left pits" doesn't really help any.

Before people argue against this and try to shut it down, remember it's only to say someone left pits, or at the very most what pad they took to leave pits. Personally I think doing it like this is just perfect and won't have anyone be scared of hunting since the message won't say "Eighty Swords entered level 3 of Destard" since you can't go there from pits.

What are the odds you find someone with a system message saying they left pits? It's like 1 in 4 for blue players, 1 in 2 for red players and if you know the person you're trying to find it's even better. Example: I will almost never go to Occlo or Brit Bridge so you have a 1 in 2 chance of finding me once you see "Eighty Swords left pits". If you wait 5 seconds to recall to Britain your chances of finding me are like 1 in 1,000,000 since I can recall to anywhere from here or I might just run to a vendor out of sight of the area where you enter Britain, or your rune might not even be marked in the same area right where people enter Britain so by the time you recall there and run around to the area people enter you've missed me.

There's no harm to try it I guess, that's the only real way we will know. But I don't think I agree with the exact region being displayed on the page, as this could result in more people sitting around in the pits, whichhhhhhh I believe is the issue we are trying to fix.

That's the spirit! To be honest I'm not exactly in favor of displaying every region or xyz co-ordinates on the status page either. That's why I've been focusing on this 1 very simply system message.

My view on the whole "entertain us" or "entertain yourselves" argument...

Look, we are trying to entertain ourselves, but sometimes we need a little helping hand, like a message saying "Eighty Swords entered Occlo" holy shit that's the best news of the day, a noob pvper to go and kill and take his supplies! Something to do for 5 minutes! YAY!

[imported_LudaKrishna]

And sorry to tell you but its not PvP server at all, its just a server where PvPing is allowed and PvP events being held.
And what I can suggest to make it fun for PvPers? Events. Yes, PvP events. Until our playerbase will grow enought to make PvPers entertain themselves without help from the staff. 60++ Ppl would be enought, not less:/

I agree with GangBang on this one.

And it's the same (6-7..max 10) people who always PvP n gank.



Try that msg when ppl leaving pits for a week, it's worth a shot imo, I don't see why it's being shot down....

[imported_MadMan]

Since so many staff are reading this thread quite actively ill put in a suggestion just for a quick answer yes or no needed or a strong possibilty.

Howabout newbied runes?

[imported_Sindern]

A good thing to encourage PVP is good old fashioned hatred. Loot a house, grief kill someone and make their life hell, trash talk, etc. It makes me happy to see trash talk because that's what causes the PVP that is really satisfying. It's hard for me to believe that someone can come up with complex RP stories, but are unable to find it possible that someone might curse or be rude in a fantasy world. PVP/L337 mentality can easily be stuck into an RP setting as well if you compare them to something like inner-city gangs. A stylized way of speech, seemingly unprovoked violence, materialist mentality, etc. *shrug* I'm rambling. Where's my caffiene?